Mminiatures WIP Thread

[mminiatures]

I though this would be a cool idea as well as a way to check my own progress as I work through a sculpt. The idea is simple: I see sculpts in layers or steps-ie, the trousers of both legs, then the bottom of the tunic and hem of the hauberk, next the torso armour, then arms, neck area, ect-so I will post an image of my progress as each layer is complete. Then I will list my aims for the next step; what I need to accomplish and what problems I am likely to encounter. Hopefully this will help me to avoid making mistakes more than once when they are broken down step by step. I already do this in my head but I continue to have troubles, for example I recently tossed the third sculpt in a row with the stupid problem of too wide hips, which is pretty easily avoided when you look out for it.

So Here is what I am working on now. It is a Serbian Crossbowman. I like the idea of doing serbs becuase they are an intersting and unique army becuase of their signature oversized gorgets, and, just as importantly, not a single company has had a go at them in 28mm so if they work out they may be a good seller; they are featured in the WAB Vlad Suppliment so there should be some buyers out there.

Enough rambling, heres the first step.

Step: Legs
Important points:
-Keeping the knee at the middle of the leg, not too low.
-Defining the knee with as few wrinkles as possible, but making the definition clear
-keeping the hips thin enough ( they're thinner than I think!)
-defining the boots with wrinkles reflecting their heavier material than the trousers
-keeping shoulders not too broad



Next Up: Hem of tunic
-keep it VERY THIN
-attatch to torso without making stomach or shoulders too broad
-use minimal winkles to suggest movement
-keep cloth perpenduclar to teh ground, ie, the tunic does not flair out as it falls

Feedback is of course welcome! This way a problem can be stopped before it is too late. There is nothing more annoying than nearly finishing before realising that the right knee is off.

[menace]

No bad criticim so far! As you are giving us a great insight into the problems of sculpting would it be possible you could add a few tips?? I'm really into trying something along with your thread and maybe an idea of how long to leave the GS before working it or the tools or how you achieve some litle things like the folds would be cool... good luck

[razhburz]

looking good so far mate
Like Dennis said a few tips would be great too

[mousekiller]

Definitely got my interests peeked here. Great start, and great tips too.

[mminiatures]

menace said:

how you achieve some litle things like the folds would be cool...

Haha this is really a huge understatement- the final result looks simple but it is really the product of literally dozens of attempts which go un-photographed. No doubt, practice, not skill, is a huge part of getting cloth configurations correct. You just have to have an eye for it. Determine what you with to achieve and consider the best way to do it, ie: I want to show the position of the knee clearly. First I thought that thsi would most easily be achieved with big billowing pants so that I could use as many wrinkles as I wanted to desplay the motion (in general the more wrinkles you use the more obvious motion becomes; the problem is not using so many wrinkles that it looks totally rediculous.).

Actually I figured after several attempts and study of ebob's new archers and some perry AO spearmen that the best thing to do is use more accurate folds with a better understanding of how the cloth will work. If you know exectly what fold goes where-a photo or a model miniature is veryhelpful-you will not need to rely on excessive folds. Everything will just fall into place.

Also think thin, a miniatures naked leg would be really quite thin, and the trousers I am using do not make the leg allt hat much thicker. In many cases you need only to think it through and the work becomes easier. I made the pants very puffy until I realized that of course my own pants to not make my leg look 4x thicker than it really is. At first new sculps with the corrected thickness felt strange, but I realize they are more reasonable.

I know this is more of my own expierience than instruction, but I hope its of some help.

I finished the next step and I'll post it some time tommorow.

[mminiatures]

As I expected might be the problem when I started this thread, the sculpt above has gone south due to having a very thick torso which just didn't do it for me. Its rarely worth trying to fix these mistakes as in my own expierience I just spend a couple hours trying to salvage what I know is really a lost cause, hours which could be better spent with a fresh start.

So I think it makes sense for me to only post the odd stage as I get farther along in the sculpt. Then I won't be posting a hundred pairs of pants and then saying the sculpt turned out bad.

Well as sculpting minis seems to be mostly about sucking up mistakes and failures, looking critically to see what went wrong, and endeavoring to fix the mistake next time, here is what I've figured from making this mistake twice in a row (usually it seems I have to make a mistake, start again, make the mistake again, until I realize what was really wrong).
Clearly, the waist was thin enough in the WIP shot. The problem was with the layers afterwards. To fix the trouble i think I will sculpt a rough block of the naked torso rather than just a blob to suggest the chest to go under the layers of shirt, hauberk, ect. With each layer moulded to the contour of this torso, I will have a better idea of the thickness of the model as I progress with each layer. I've already started the next one. As I go on with it and if all goes well I'll post some pics.

[mousekiller]

Sorry to hear about the set back... definitely a learning tool though. Sometimes it is an inspiration for those that are not very good at something (painting, sculpting, whatever) to hear that things are not always so easily achieved, especially by those that excell at it. Can't wait to see more, and you may have even convinced me (who has trouble sculpting rocks) to have a go at it...

[jabberwocky]

Thanks for posting your trials and tribulations. This is definitely a learning experience for me as I watch you progress. I may eventually do a bit of sculpting of my own and watching this will (hopefully) minimize any mistakes. Obviously, seeing and doing are worlds apart, but knowing the techniques employed is a helpful first step. Thanks again!

[mminiatures]

All new:


Here I concentrated on:
-Narrower hips with layers
-Correct knee height (I think I'm getting the hang of this)
-Stylish mustache

The chainmail looks fine in real life, though the detail is somewhat lost in the photograph. He will be running and cradling his crossbow.

Next step: ARMOUR! A serious dread of mine, I've been practicing but its very tough to get right. He's going to be wearing gauntlets, rembrace, and couter, so I will have to practice some more of these pieces. It seems most logical to me to do the whole arm at once, though its sure difficult to keep the angles straight. I've only done a couple for practice so it may take some more work before I produce something workable...

[Tim C]

Looking good mate, just a thought though the chainmail (it could be the photo) looks a little undefined I am looking at it from a painting perspective and there doesn't seem to be enough relief in the linkage to make painting it easy.
I love the face and I am looking forward to seeing this one progress.

[mousekiller]

I agree with Tim on the chainmail, though as you said it may be the photo. One of the biggest things I hate when I get a new mini is undefined chainmail (like all the new GW Plastic Dwarfs).

Great progression on this guy. Good luck with the armour bits.

[mminiatures]

I'm hear ya, I thought it over and the issue is that brown stuff, being less sticky than green, forms the links in the mail better than green as it is more rigid but is ultimately unsuitable for this application becuase the adhesion of green stuff pulls each ring up a tiny bit, creating the raised surface which makes painting it easier.

I've sawed off the brown chain and will resculpt it tonight if I have a moment.

This is what I want to hear, now I can fix the problem fairly easily rather than wishing I had in a few days when its finished and too late.

[roguetrader]

@mminiatures, i have been trying to sculpt chainmail, but it keeps coming out funny and disorganised, i got a "tip" to use a sharp point instrument, like a pin, and put a hole on the gs and pull down slightly, and then onthe next row pull up, but its not really working for me, how do you do yours please so that i can give your method a go??? thanks

[razhburz]

thats great mate love the mustache

[mminiatures]

I'm not sure if it looks like it, but the chain mail is a bit better.

I also shortened the torso by 1.5 mm. For no really good reason I've been arbitrarily floating between 28mm and 30mm scales. This results in some slightly stretched looking figures. Although the difference is not hugely noticeable, I think it will improve the overall look.

[Tim C]

A big improvement, look forward to seeing the next stage.

[jabberwocky]

Looks good--not much to offer beyond that...I am looking forward to seeing the next step.

[mminiatures]

Frustrated with choosing correct arm potion and neck length on this one I took some good advice from ebob and reworked my armature:

[mutantpotato]

A chocolate mini, yummy! ;D The face looks great, can't say much else this early. To me the left arm looks shorter than the right one, am I right Btw, how is greens stuff compared to brown stuff?

[mminiatures]

Yes one is shorter than the other the reason being that the right one must have a built in hand to support the saber while the left are is cut off at the wrist.

[mminiatures]

This is sort of just to make sure the thread doesn't go too far and I forget about it. I have no pics as my computer's been in the repair shop for a while and there seemed no point in taking pictures with nowhwere to put them.

I've been working in an Albanian of the 15th century, and after a few attempts I think I'm getting the hang of the greatcoat which to me is really difficult (it stopped me from being able to do WWI Russians. Now I have some idea how to do them I'd like to give those a try some day!) The trick lies in sculpting it in two halfs, first the left and then the right. I could write some more on the technique but I don't reckon anyone would have any use for it.

I also have a commission for a 54mm rottweiler but I've put it off, I'll have to start soon.

I'll be in Georgia for this week so who knows how much free time I'll have for sculpting, but at any rate the computer should be back when I get home so I'll put up some pictures of whatever I'm working on.

[Tim C]

Look forward to seeing an update when you get the time and also your computer back mate.

[mminiatures]

Just the hat and a few small details remain.

[mousekiller]

Went from stick figure to wow in one small step...

Great work, really looks top notch.

[Tim C]

superb mate, what a transformation on this guy.